twice barack obama won the white house by running against him, in '08 and again in '12. he's never carped. he never criticized. i think that has played well with people. it's hard to look back and say that iraq was anything other than a disaster, and and you can see the shadow and echoes of iraq in the disiks right now as we approach syria or anyplace else-- iran. it's-- you know, that is-- that was a defining moment for this country's foreign policy. >> woodruff: and for his presidenciy? >> yeah, i think it was the poeps-9/11. iraq and afghanistan, it's hard to defend the iraq war as we see it right now. i do think preventing another terror attack, creating that apparatus, that's on the plus side of the ledger. i'm not sure it will outweigh when history judges but i do think he gets credit for that. >> the one thing i do agree with david with is mitt romney lost in 2012 in large part because he at no point did not show any empathy. by 81-18 voters on election day said barack obama cares more about people like me than mitt romney. and they could have used a large dollop